Plastikball, Polyball, Nicht-Zelluloidball

[Tackiness]

Mehr von Sharara (Antwort auf Anfrage eines belgischen Sportsfreunds, auf mehreren englischsprachigen Foren publiziert):

Zitat von ITTF President

Hi Lorenzo,

There is no upcoming world-wide ban of celluloid, this was a simplification of the current status and the status on the use of celluloid for many years past. Their is also no health issue with the finished product. The issue is in the manufacturing of the celluloid sheets that are used to make the ping pong balls. These sheets are produced from raw celluloid, which is a highly fibrous and flammable material. It is banned on commercial flights for many years now, this is nothing new. The use of the celluloid in producing products (ping pong balls, motion picture film, etc.) has become virtually extinct due to the very high health hazard to the workers using these materials. It is the same case for Asbestos. These are materials with very thin and minute fibres that are inhaled and stick to the lungs causing, as you can imagine, lung disease. In some western countries there is an outright ban on the use of asbestos or celluloid at the raw material level for many years now. There is no ban for the use of the finished product. This is quite hypocritical if you ask me "We do not want to hurt our people, but let others get hurt". The so-called "others" are waking up and realizing that such materials are harmful for their workers and have started to impose restrictions in production in form of a gradual decrease in the production for a steady reduction and eventual stoppage of production all together. Other governments have imposed very strict regulations for the factories that have celluloid production at the raw level. Some of these restrictions are very expensive, so manufacturers find it cheaper, and healthier, to change the material and use composites or plastics that are less hazardous or hopefully safe to use by the workers. The film industry as you probably know is going digital more and more every day.


For table tennis balls (ping pong) balls, the manufacturers have become almost extinct. There are basically 2 in China that produce good quality ping pong balls, 1 in Japan, and 1 in Korea. There was also one in Eastern Europe but it closed several years ago. I personally started to warn manufacturers more than 6 years ago, that the use of raw celluloid will be more and more regulated, as this was the trend in all other countries. This was taken seriously by Japan, and their solution was to buy balls made in China, same as the European companies have been doing for more than 20 years since the production of raw celluloid in their own countries was no longer viable. As you know, China was admitted to the WTO a couple of years ago and hence must abide by the WTO's standards and regulations. The celluloid production factories have been given a period of time to reduce their production, and the manufacturers that rely on the finished celluloid product are of course very concerned that they will no longer be able to produce their products in a few years time. This is when the two largest ping pong ball factories in the world (in China) woke up and started looking at other technologies to produce ping pong balls with other non-hazardous materials. The result is what we refer to today as the POLY balls.


Since a completely new technology was being invented for the new balls, I asked the manufacturers to seize this opportunity and produce better quality balls: seamless, round, even hardness, etc. This is hopefully what will happen. We will transform what could have been a crisis of having a shortage of ping pong balls, hence rendering them very expensive and probably extinct, to a positive result of better quality balls for all to enjoy. A by-product of this change is that POLY balls could be produced everywhere and not just in Chia. This may help make them more competitive and affect the price positively (cheaper) after a while.


I would like to stress that plastic balls have been in our regulations for more than 50 years, indeed Dunlop and Halex in England used to produce plastic balls, with an old technology, when they stopped producing raw celluloid in the UK at that time. So, as far as regulations are concerned there is no change, POLY balls are legal and always were. What would need a regulation change in a couple of years is the removal of the legality of using celluloid balls at ITTF events. However, we must give enough time to the manufacturers and resellers to deplete their stocks.


To answer your questions below, for (1), (2) and (3), perhaps I was misunderstood. The ban on celluloid production (also Asbestos) varies from country to country and started more than 30 years ago in some countries. The only countries left to produce raw celluloid used for the manufacturing of ping pong balls can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Already Japan is on a declining quota, and as of last year China is also on a declining quota. I am not sure about Korea. So, if we wait until these countries also stop the production of raw celluloid, then we would be in trouble. This is why we are pro-active and have pushed for a solution which remains within our rules and that was available to us all along. There are no other reasons for changing to POLY balls.


Regarding your question (4), yes, I am extremely concerned with the direction our sport has taken that has made the defensive player almost extinct. I really admire someone like Joo Se Hyuk who has persevered in the onslaught of attacking players. Players are asking for spinier and faster equipment all the time. This is always to the disadvantage of the defensive player. Faster blades, faster and thicker sponge, tackier rubber, etc., is all very bad for the defensive player. But that is the natural trend that the sport has taken. This is true in most sports.


I am not sure how the new ball will affect modern defensive players. Personally I thought that the increase from 38mm to 40 mm would help the defensive player, and it should. But most coaches and most defensive players were not able to figure out how to change and modify their techniques to take advantage of the new larger ball. They played the same way and found it more difficult to vary the spin and more difficult to attack from far. It took them a long time to adjust. This is why I admire Joo Se Hyuk, he is a classic defender (not how I imagined the evolution of a defender) and yet he remains in the top 10 in the World. Really amazing.


Regarding the new ball, the reports we have from the players that tried them is that it is more bouncy and less spiny. What does this mean for the defensive player? I don't know. Hopefully good news.


Please feel free to post this response to the Forum.


Lorenzo, I answered this e-mail exceptionally because of your genuine concern, however, you must understand that I receive more than 300 e-mails daily on my ITTF e-mail account and would find it difficult to engage in an exchange of e-mails. This is why I recommend that you post this response for others to see.


Thank you for understanding.


Adham Sharara
ITTF

[Mighty]

Zitat von Tackiness

Mehr von Sharara (Antwort auf Anfrage eines belgischen Sportsfreunds, auf mehreren englischsprachigen Foren publiziert):

Das ist die Antwort auf Shararas Antwort, vom User Wturber:

So basically he admitted that he said something that was quite untrue.

I suggest that you look at his claims about fibers and cellulose with that misinformation in mind. Once manufacturers receive nitrocellulose to make the celluloid, it isn't fibrous at all. In fact, nitro-cellulose is typically shipped packed in liquid to minimize the volatility issues he mentions. So even it it was still fibrous, it is wet and so won't present much of an airborne issue. Further, nitrocellulose is used a wide range of products not just in celluloid. It ain't going away due to health hazards from the cellulose fibers. It is made on I think five or six continents.

Celluloid hasn't been slowly replaced worldwide due to the health hazards from fibers, it has been replaced because it is an older plastic and better or cheaper plastics have been found for most of its uses.

All it takes is a little research to discover that many manufacturers have been using cellulose fibers to replace the more dangerous asbestos fibers in many products. Further, paper is full of cellulose fibers, so is toilet paper and the tissue paper that we blow our noses with, so is your back yard. Plants are something like 30% cellulose fiber. Cotton is something like 90% cellulose fiber. Health hazard from cellulose fibers, lets get real.

Does he really expect us to believe that there is any real chance that the table tennis industry would allow table tennis balls to not be produced in the needed quantities. Get real. These are all invented reasons. Just as one ITTF official invented the claim that the making of celluloid was 80% the same as making nitro-glycerin.

Someone questioned why I considered it unimportant to ask Adham Sharara these questions. Well, there's your answer. You can't expect a straight, well informed answer from him. Better to do the research yourself because you can't trust what he says. I don't think his answers and explanation are about informing or enlightening people. I think that they are about misinformation. He made up a ban. Now he appears to be making up health hazards as a further reason. The Japanese celluloid company I asked about it confirmed that the notion that there are health hazards from cellulose fibers in the production of celluloid is imagined.

I can only guess at his motives. It is easy to discover that the things he has been saying on this topic are either untrue or are gross exaggerations.

[Die Macht im Norden]

...This was taken seriously by Japan, and their solution was to buy balls made in China...

Heißt das, der Nittaku Premium Ball made in japan kommt doch aus China?

[grimm91]

Fazit: Sharara ist entweder ein Lügner oder völlig Planlos, was ich aber nicht glauben kann.

Die ITTF/Sharara hat einfach gemerkt, dass man momentan einfach keinen Rückhalt für weitere Regeländerungen hat. Jetzt versuchen sie das geschickt zu umgehen indem sie Psydogründe vorschieben.

Ich bin wirklich gespannt wie sich der neue Ball hinterher spielen wird - bestimmt nicht langsamer und spinloser. Testbälle wirds bestimmt auch geben

Ich bin neugierig was er für TT-Profis findet, die dann in irgendwelchen Berichten vom neuen Ball schwärmen. (Ich tippe auf Block/Konter-Spieler)

[mtta]

Zitat von Azadon

Bei Aldi, gleich neben den Eiern...

Mal im Ernst, ich würde mal sagen ausm Tischtennisfachgeschäft deiner Wahl, sobald die Dinger auf den Markt gekommen sind?!

Das ist mir schon klar, und ich muss zugeben ich habe mich etwas falsch ausgedrückt. Ich wollte eigentlich fragen, ob man jetzt schon solche Bälle irgendwo auftreiben kann.

[Mighty]

Zitat von grimm91

Ich bin wirklich gespannt wie sich der neue Ball hinterher spielen wird - bestimmt nicht langsamer und spinloser. Testbälle wirds bestimmt auch geben

Auf demselben Forum hat der Admin Samsonovs Antwort veröffentlicht:

...We have been testing the balls, it is not that bad. Less rotation, higher bounce, close to the table is fast, if you go back - balls slow down a lot, sound is different. So, it is still a big change.

[Markus_]

Weniger Spin, höherer Ballabsprung, ein Hoch auf den gefühllosen Klopper.

Aber wie immer heißt es erstmal abwarten und dann selber testen.

[Hillegosser]

Zitat von grimm91

Fazit: Sharara ist entweder ein Lügner oder völlig Planlos, was ich aber nicht glauben kann.

Oder unglaublich naiv.

Personally I thought that the increase from 38mm to 40 mm would help the defensive player, and it should.
But most coaches and most defensive players were not able to figure out how to change and modify their techniques to take advantage of the new larger ball.

Aha! Er hatte also recht und schuld waren nur Spieler und Trainer, die nicht in der Lage waren sich auf den 40mm Ball einzustellen.

This is why I admire Joo Se Hyuk, he is a classic defender (not how I imagined the evolution of a defender) and yet he remains in the top 10 in the World. Really amazing.

Joo ist klassischer Verteidiger... aber sicher.

A by-product of this change is that POLY balls could be produced everywhere and not just in Chia. This may help make them more competitive and affect the price positively (cheaper) after a while.

Und das higlight für mich:
Irgendwo anders als in China wird dann billiger produziert.

[Variatio]

Zitat von Hillegosser

(...)

So ziemlich das gleiche wollte ich auch schon schreiben. Es mag ja durchaus gute Gruende fuer einen Wechsel von Celluloid auf Plastik geben - aber Sharara muss noch ein Weilchen ueben, bis er das plausibel verkaufen kann!

Grundsaetzlich bin ich durchaus gespannt, wie sich die neuen Baelle spielen. Ich denke, wir sollten uns hueten, sie im Vorneherein zu verteufeln - denn das Gelbe vom Ei sind die bisherigen Baelle definitiv nicht.
Wenn sie sich gut spielen, runder sind sowie laenger halten, koennen wir langfristig nur gewinnen.

[Wuuzzaa]

Zitat von Hillegosser

...

Sehr amüsant
Da kann ich dir nur Recht geben.

Kann man Sharara nicht irgendwie abwählen? Irgendwie nervt der Kerl mit seinen Regeländerungen (auch wenn ich nun manche richtig gut finde) immer mehr.

Die Skifahrer wehren sich nun auch gegen Regeländerungen --> 1.Link, 2.Link, 3.Link wobei es laut dem Skiverband um die Gesundheit der Spieler geht (war da nicht was bei uns mit Frischkleben??).
Können sich auch nicht unsere Profis mal gegen Regeländerungen aussprechen?