Foreign languages...

[Jamiro]

The most important thing is motivation! For example: I learnd 3 years Dutch at a school. But although Im German (Dutch and German are REALLY close), my dutch is really bad, because I didnt like it.
Anyway, I am studing 3 years Japanese and I would say, my Japanese is ok. Of course, Japanese is total different compared with German.
But I´m sure, If I had the same motivation for Dutch like for Japanese, I would speak Dutch fluently now.

[Florian L.]

What is most important when learning a language?

First of all there is a huge difference between learning and acquisition. Acquisition will be the aim of every language learner. The difference is at the cognitive level since the knowledge you acquire is automaticed whereas learnt knowledge needs some time to activate and is intentionally used. In other words acquisition is implicit and learning explicit and the resulting knowledge from learning is declarative and from acquisition it is prodedual (no resorting to rules).
How to reach this goal?
There are thousands of approaches and strategies. The most important are the comprehensible and authentic input approach which emphasises that the presented language has to be slightly above the current level but also has to be original language. The effects for the language classroom are that, even if the learners have a low language level they need to face authentic material. This might be children books for beginners or teenage stories for advanced learners. During the process of dealing with the material there is the possibility to let the learners explore the system (e.g. grammer rules) for them selves or to give them the information before the actual reading.

In addition there is the MI (multiple intellegences) by H. Gardner idea which points out that every student has a special prefered "intellegence" (you could call it a gift, too. musical, visual, logical,...) which has to be activtated during the education and leads to the best results.

The role of the native language was discussed very often and there are still existing different views about it. The grammar-translation-method refers in all areas of language to the mother tongue (this method offers the classic model of language learning, that means a lot of repetitions, all mistakes are corrected immediately). On the other hand there is the Direct method which uses the target language exclusively for all commmunication purposes during the class while the Cognitive Code methode uses both languages in class.

From my point of view it is crucial to keep the pupils motivated and to face them as early as possible with practical communication situations. Of course you have to receive a basic skill level (some grammar rules and vocabulary).

To my own situation. I am speaking and writing English at an advanced to proficient level because of my studies. I have been studying to become an English teacher since last october. I gave you only a small amount of the information I received (only for didactics) since october and I am glad to have the ability to recite my learned knowledge (for the exams next week) here. My receptive skills (reading and listening) are at an almost native like level because most of the reading we do are in English (mostly scientific but for literature and cultural studies we deal with common works as well).

In addition I am an average French speaker. Mais le temps d´école est passé et je n´ai pas des possibilites de faire les études. Quelle dommage.
In our grammar school A-level French course we even watched original movies since we all had a pretty high level but it vanishes when not practicing. The movie was "Au revoir les enfants", a very touching movie which impressed me heavily.

Maybe my post increases the action here a little.

Till next time.

[Tony_Iommi]

Zitat von Florian L.

Maybe my post increases the action here a little.

I had high hopes, too, buddy. Unfortunately and to my surprise, we were wrong - given that we have sooo many folks around here, who claim (or pretend? ) having such a great command of English.

[luxxx]

step one: you need motivation. if you're forced to learn it and don't like it, it's over.
step two: learn the alphabet in that language and i mean really learn how to pronounce the letters and sounds of the language. that way you can make sure that you don't give all the words a sound of your own language.
if your language does not have those sounds learn them (that's especially hard for english speaking people (well let's face it, it's a pretty easy language).
step three: learn the basics, i.e. grammar present tense and past tense.
step four: build a basic vocabulary and common phrases.
step five: read things and try to understand it. it'll be easier if you read a text you already have read in you own language. don't start with masterpieces of literature.
step six: get exposed to the sound of the language, dvds in multiple languages are perfect for that especially if you know them in your language.
step seven: go out there and try speaking the damn language with native speakers. if you were exposed to the language enough you'll be surprised how easy it is.
it's VERY important NOT to build sentences in your own language and translate them you have to build them in the target language. it's much faster and and easier.
final step: get used to the slang accent of the area you wanna speak the language in and find YOUR OWN STYLE.

[Florian L.]

@luxxx
Your plan is a very scientific one (a scholastic one) since the first authentic communicative situations occur during the last steps but nevertheless it will work appropriately. I would like to add an aspect to step two:

Sounds don´t occur in isolation. There are existing several ones which are extremely problematic for German English learners. For instance these are th and s combinations where they occur in a close linguisitc environment. Further examples are the differences between w and v and the neutralisation of t and d (the so called "Auslautverhärtung"). The German pun "Er fuhr Ford und kam nicht wieder." won´t work if a native English speaker tries to pronounce it appropriately.
For conclusion you have to exercice or learn sound combinations as well.

[Tony_Iommi]

luxxx, admittedly, glancing through your post the first time, I really didn't know where you were heading on to. A little later on, however, and after a view rewiews, things came together a little more comprehensible.

Nevertheless, I think Florian raised a couple of interesting points and I am curious to see your response to it.

Honestly, I do think it all comes down to the ability to communicate amongst each other. It is as simple as that and there's no fucking rocket science to it.

Alright, that should open up the floor for some trash talk and, hands down, isn't that what we were waitin' for? So, here's the deal: we can either keep this thread as posh as it was designed for initially, or we turn that into something real. So let's put all the BS aside and get down to the wire..

Alright, if there's any American or English-speaking native out there, who has the slightest interest in ping-pong or simply the guts to kick some ass, please chip in here. We're are a bunch of German douchebags and fags (once my folks are done google-ing, they gonna kick me out, but whatever) tryin' to get this thing up to speed,internationally.

But, you know what really sucks big time? - Artie Lange left Howard...in remorse and grief I'm ready to kick the bucket, definitely. So what's your take?

[marian]

I don't like french. Some people say that french is a wonderful language, but I think french sounds bad..
fortunately I can speak spanish well..

[Tony_Iommi]

[QUOTE=marian;1431003]Some people say that french is a wonderful language, but I think french sounds bad....[/QUOTE]

It sounds bad? That part I don't get at all. Well, I should say it strongly depends on the geographical region. The worst French I've ever came across with was in Marseille. That indeed sounds like as if people chew on dog-s**t as they speak. The best French I probably heard was in Switzerland, in and around Geneva.

[Against All Odds]

Zitat von Tony_Iommi

That indeed sounds like as if people chew on dog-shit as they speak.

Just like any English accent

The best French I probably heard was in Switzerland, in and around Geneva.

The best French is spoken in Brittany.


@ marian:
Spanish might be useful, but it isn't a beautiful language...

[Tony_Iommi]

Zitat von Against All Odds

Just like any English accent

True.

Zitat von Against All Odds

The best French is spoken in Brittany.

Alright then - I haven't been there, yet, so what do I know...